Thursday, June 10, 2010

Academia the Unappealing

At a recent meeting with my collaborators and their groups, I asked a collaborator's student, who is getting ready to graduate, if she planned on going on the academic track (postdoc, then tenure track). She said 'Oh, no way!' Another student, who will graduate in a few months, concurred that he would never ever consider going into academia.

My colleagues (the other faculty) and I looked at each other in mock disbelief. Actually, these days I almost never hear that students want to continue into academia. So we started chatting about why it is so, and what it is that we as faculty do to make academia look so unappealing to students. My collaborator's student said that she wanted to explore other things in life. For her, it was a question of whether she would get more deeply into her technical field or broaden her horizons professionally, and the latter is her choice.

The other student said he felt it was all too much about egos (I guess that doesn't bode well for us, the PIs!), and that he preferred working as part of a team (he had a previous position in industry before grad school). He missed that -- being able to work on technically focused projects, exchanging ideas and information, and not having to worry about self-promotion. One of my faculty collaborators pointed out that there was certainly some serious elbowing going on in industry if one wanted to rise through the ranks to, say, division manager, but that, yes, if my student wanted to stay on an elbow-light technical path, he could probably pull it off in a solid company.

Another student said that he thought that more flexibility in academia was a myth and that we were all enslaved by the granting agencies. He openly asked if we would ever do the project we were all meeting about if it hadn't been in a hot area, with a lot of funding, and we had been successful in getting the grant. I couldn't help but chuckle: I understand that from his romanticized perspective of what science is, jumping on the wagon to do work in one’s general area just because it is hot and fundable is somehow superficial or otherwise unseemly, and I remember thinking that too, a while ago. I now look at it as simply being in tune what other people actually care about and what goes on in the field. And, as a former professor of mine said once upon a time: "There are no trivial questions, regardless of area, as long as you are at the area's cutting edge."

My view of what we as academics do has grown progressively more cynical over the years, but I think I am also cured of quite a bit of snobbery I had going in. It used to be all about what I think is cool or technically challenging, regardless of what anyone else thought. Nowadays, what I do is much more driven, one way or another, by what other people care about: what the program manager wants to fund, what is hot in the field, what people want to read about and cite, and what my collaborators want to do. Of course, I am not advocating being constantly in a reactive mode in terms of research direction, but you have to keep abreast of what the rest of the world is doing, adjust your internal gauge to accommodate for the overall scientific trends, and have a healthy mix of projects that range from pure discovery-driven personal passion to hot new stuff where funding is being funneled. I feel that, unless you keep a mix, you either sink (no funds if projects are not hot) or you sell your soul (it’s no fun if all you ever do is chase the berries).

At the same meeting, a student of mine chimed in "Well, if you didn't have to teach and write grants and advise us, you'd have many more papers and do much more work on [my pet topic]." I told him that while I would certainly do much more on that one topic, I could not possibly do, on my own, all the work that he and all the other students before him have done cumulatively on all the different projects. As for my pet project of yore, I used to long to work on it and would savor the little chunks of time I could carve to devote to it. But I grew weary of it; I realized that there is a very, very small community thinking about these problems, which are really hard, and that most people were making incremental, nearly insignificant tweaks to known models. There are two or three really big, important questions to answer in the context of my pet topic, and I realized that if I am going to keep working on it, I might as well grab the bull by the horns or not engage at all. So there you have it, plans for my next sabbatical.

I know it took me a while to make peace with the fact that I now manage much more than I do research. However, I really enjoy reveling in the big picture and living vicariously through –- uhm, overseeing -- my students' work, going through the details of different, distinct projects with each one of them. I would never be able to have this much breadth if it was just me. And then, there is writing. Writing papers is my favorite part of a project: through writing, things fall into place, first in my mind and then in the manuscript. I love how writing helps me think and distill the picture into the essential science behind months of work. And then I get to talk to people about the work at conferences and get new ideas for follow-on work after I hear colleagues talk about their projects... What’s not to love?

I believe academic research is a wonderful pursuit, and I think that, if a person is realistic about what it takes to secure enough funding to sustain a viable group, one can actually still have a lot of flexibility and a lot of fun, with awesome, very smart people. Some of whom then grow up and tell you they think academia sucks and they would never ever do what you do. Oh well.

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N.B. I wanted this post to somewhat balance out the many posts in the blogosphere that focus on too many people wanting to go into academia and no one being able to. My experience is quite the opposite: the students in my and my collaborators' groups are quite against going into academia. I was surprised by how passionately some students were against it. Rather, I was expecting that for more of them academia were an option, maybe not a too appealing one, but I didn't expect to hear we're selling out souls to the granting agencies or that students view our advising as a poor substitute for doing research on our own. None of the students involved in the discussion had families, so the work-family balance didn't come up, but it is a very important issue that does dissuade many people from an academic path (see, for instance, irongrrl's comment below). My take is that there are wonderful research and non-research opportunities out there for people with PhD's, and most of them pay significantly better than academia and are very intellectually stimulating. All of my graduated PhD students went to well-paid, supportive industry jobs or national labs and are doing great, so this article should not be construed as me passing judgment on non-academia track, quite the contrary. It's just that I was taken aback by how unappealing academia was perceived to be by the students at this particular meeting, but perhaps this is exactly how it deserves to be perceived nowadays, with competition too fierce and claims on one's life and sanity too high...

16 comments:

irongrrl said...

I'm part of the group of newly minted PhDs planning to leave academia. But, I never gasped in horror at the prospect of being an academic. I switched back and forth probably ten times a day between whether I wanted to stay in academia or not, before I finally settled on a path (or at least, a starting point to that path). The decision came largely from the fact that for my family's sake, I need to settle in one place as soon as possible, and an academic career path is less compatible with that than an industrial path. For the tenure-track, I would have to move somewhere for a post-doc and then move elsewhere for a faculty position, and I probably would not get to be very picky about the location of this faculty position. That's a big drawback. And of course, this is all very contingent on me being able to find a faculty position. This may be something that your students are thinking but didn't say: there are not that many faculty positions out there. The system is graduating more PhDs than there are jobs for, especially in academia.

From a purely science perspective, I think I could be equally satisfied doing academic or industrial research. The perception from certain students that it is a bad thing for granting agencies to be driving research is kind of funny; what do they think drives industrial research? Consumers, market forces. You have to sell your work either way, whether you're in academia or industry. There are pros and cons to both career paths, but I take particular issue with one aspect of the academic machine: having a work-life balance is actively discouraged. I know some professors manage to maintain a healthy family and social life and still be successful, but their success is typically in spite of this, not because of it. In this profession, it seems that the more of your life you sacrifice to the job, the better chance you have at making it. I cannot at present support this kind of value system, especially since I think a list of priorities that places work at the top is one of the most fundamental things wrong with the US.

So, I'm not strictly opposed to staying in academia, and I occasionally still wonder if I'm doing the right thing, I just feel that it is not appropriate for me right now, for a variety of reasons. I also want to see what the rest of the world of science looks like, and how this stuff is done outside of academia. I hope my adviser does not feel similarly slighted that I am not following his path. It's really not about him at all, he set a marvelous example for how to do it right. But even with his example, I want to try something new.

GMP said...

Hi irongrrl,

Thanks for the comment. I don't think I feel slighted by the students' choices. I actually wanted this post to somewhat balance out the many posts that focus on too many people wanting to go in academia and no one being able to. My experience, presented here, is quite the opposite: the students in my and my collaborators' groups are quite against going to academia. It was kind of surprising how passionately some students were against it. I was expecting that for more of them academia were an option, maybe not a too appealing one, but I didn't expect to hear we're selling out souls to the granting agencies.

I actually completely agree with you, 100%, on the family issue and the fact that you don't want to drag them all around the country through a string of postdocs. I had my 1st kid when I started grad school, and did not want to go through endless relocations after my PhD. In my field, luckily, it is not entirely impossible to get a faculy position without a postdoc (although they are certainly very, very desirable). I was very fortunate to get a faculty position right out of grad school, but I can tell you, if I had had to go through a series of postdocs, I probably would not have stayed in academia.

So my take is that there are wonderful research and nonresearch oportunities out there for people with PhD's, and most of them pay significantly better and are very intellectually stimulating. All of my students went to well-paid, supportive industry and national labs and are doing great, so I'm totally not passing judgement on non-academia track. Academia can easily take everything you have and give very little in return...

Neo said...

Hi,
I would like to discuss issue with different perspective-
Please check this link. from Eric Drexler.

http://metamodern.com/2009/11/27/great-science-great-scientists-and-icons/

Historically speaking, greatest discoveries of science were made by young men, in their very early age. Newton, Einstein, or Darwin to quote.

I believe science evolved as unbureaucratic activity, and it should be so. As modern universities, and research organizations grew over decades, they become more and more complex and it required complex processes of management, funding, promotion, etc. So when the person is at his/her most creative age, (s)he may be insecure or may not permission or funds to carry out independent research.

And in comparision, many companies have realized utility of "flat" organizations. Or have similar other measures that encourage creativity.
May be that's why young creative don't prefer academic life.


Neo

prodigal academic said...

Great post, GMP!

I was one of those people! I didn't want to into academia when I finished my PhD. I had this idea that having kids was not a good idea until post-tenure (this was due to lack of role-models), and I had no desire to be treated like the token women (1 each) at my undergrad and PhD departments, with all the petty crap (like not telling the female prof about a meeting, then berating her for missing it, etc).

I also really wanted to keep working in the lab, and it was readily apparent that profs didn't have time for that. I ended up at a National Lab, where I got to do lots of fun research, and worked on my own projects in the lab until I left. After a while, though, I started to have more ideas than I could carry out myself, and the overhead structure (300% on salary, 0% on everything else) meant that I couldn't sustain a large enough group to explore my ideas. I was also exposed to many more women in academia though meetings and seminar speakers, so I came to realize that my job at National Lab was really similar in many ways to an academic job, and that having kids wasn't really a career killer in the right department. So I went back.

I am surprised to hear that so many students think that self-promotion is more of an issue in academia (not my experience) or that academia is not so flexible. Thus far, no one in my group wants to be a prof either. :-)

Anonymous said...

It is simple: no matter what is your definition of "returns" and "effort", returns earned per effort spent are substantially less in US academia compared to US industry. And in this funding situation, this gap between academia and non-academia is only increasing.

Liz said...

interesting post!

I'm a current PhD student with no desire to have a TT career in academia. Even when beginning my PhD, I never really thought that TT would be the career path I would seek out, mostly because its required skill set doesn't really play to my strengths or interests as much as other career opportunities do.

In my lab, there are 7 pHD students. 2 are very keen to have a TT career and the other 5 are leaning more towards other opportunities, from what I can tell.

I think that there are a ton of great career options out there for folks with PhDs. Hopefully many will end up with their first choice of career type, but if not, hopefully they will realize that other rewarding options exist. It makes me sad when people convince themself that TT is the "be all and end all" of a PhD. I think it is a great options for some, among other great options.

Venkat said...

I think that cognitive dissonance is a significant factor leading to a bifurcation in trainees' academia aspirations. People who either don't want to or can't compete well may end up saying "well, academia is all politics/ego anyway!". People who either want to or can compete well may say "academia is much more intellectually rewarding than industry!". Due to confirmation bias, they may also get entrenched in and emphatic about their decisions.

EliRabett said...

The determining factor is whether there are non-academic places hiring PhDs from the research area. If not, students uninterested in academic careers will simply not start a doctoral program in that area.

engineering girl said...

Interesting post...engineering masters girl here who's going into industry but keeping the possibility of doing a phd in the future open. It would be interesting to know why all these students decided to do a phd if they were so against academia. Did they start out their PhD programs wanting to be professors then decided they disliked academia? Or did they have other goals from the beginning, and the PhD was a useful degree for whatever non-academic career?

GMP said...

engineering girl,

I think the answers to your questions depend on the field: engineering students (on average) may be of the mind that their education would eventually lead them to industry, while I suppose basic science students may be (on average) more inclined to stay in research, academic or otherwise. (I don't have any hard data about this, though.) The group of students the post was about were in 3 PhD programs, a mix of basic science and engineering fields in the physical sciences.

Btw, we definitely see increased PhD program enrollment in my department, as it has become harder to find a job with BS or even MS. Some people choose to go to grad school just to weather the economic storm...

joshphd said...

Hey GMP...I just discovered your blog. It is GREAT! I just wanted to put my 2-cents worth here in the comments. I just graduated with my Ph.D. (May 2010) in a field of chemistry. From the start of my Ph.D. I knew that I wanted to go into academics, and I never deviated from that...and it was because of my family that I made that choice. I am a husband and father (to a beautiful little girl), and I feel as though the TT provides more stability for my family than an industrial position. It also had a lot to do with the fact that I wanted to focus more on teaching rather than research. I was very very fortunate to find the ideal position in my home state that has the perfect balance of teaching and research, with great pay so that my wife can afford to stay at home with our daughter full-time (although she may work part-time).
Thanks for your blog, and keep up the great work!

Meadow said...

I like this post. Thanks GMP. Your views below -- excellent

"being in tune what other people actually care about and what goes on in the field."

"There are no trivial questions, regardless of area, as long as you are at the area's cutting edge."

GMP said...

joshphd, congrats on your recent graduation and a brand-new TT position! It's gonna be one crazy ride -- good luck!

Neo, Prodigal, Anon, Venkat, Liz, EliRabbet, engineering girl, joshphd, Meadow, thank you for the comments! I am glad you enjoyed the post.

Beaker Half Full said...

I actually linked this to my blog because I just wrote a post on a similar topic. Mostly from the disgruntled perspective of a student hearing from her elitist PIs that academia is the only good option. I am really glad to hear your positive support for students and post docs choosing what fits their lives, interests, and skill set. Great post!

GMP said...

Thanks, Beaker Half Full.

I think it's a shame for any PhD to feel like a failure. We sometime forget how few PhD's there are when compared to the rest of the world, and how exquisite the very pursuit of the PhD is. PhD's are smart, hard-working people, who end up in well-paid and usually challenging jobs, and they are able to provide good lives for their families. This should NEVER be considered a failure.

Hang in there!

Dr. Science Daddy said...

Count me in with the "I got my Ph.D., now I'm not so sure this is a great way to go." Fortunately, I have some.. less conventional leads, but they seem very promising.

If it weren't for the recession, I'd already be working in industry.